Aloha all!

George, I want to add my 3 and a half cents here...I have a friend who was in the camera and repair business for many years. He insists that all the glass is made by 2 or 3 manufacturers, so the only real difference is how much quality is put into the assembly of the lenses. Nikon, Cannon, Leica, Hasselblad etc use high quality materials and tight QC in assembly and are in the high end of overall quality. However, as long as your Tamron or other lens is working properly, it will transfer the light to your film or sensor just as well as the more expensive lens.

What I'm saying here is basically, it's not so much the equipment but the user! I contend that in the hands of a creative and skilled photographer, a Rebel kit, or whatever, will produce the same results as the $7000 camera.

I believe it is perceived by the consumer that the photographer with the biggest lens and camera, is the better photographer...but it just aint so. You can give a $7000 camera to a soccor mom, and your still going to get "soccor mom" images!

Aloha & focus well!

ggivensjr:
CPPhoto,

Are you saying the photographers you mention couldn't make the same images with less expensive lenses, all other things being equal? I wonder, what is the intrinsic value of an image?

Regards,
George

I/m not saying that, they are. I've been told by top (defined as what they are paid, name, reputation) that equipment does make a difference. Sure, Buissink has an eye that Uncle Harry may not have, but give a reasonably capable Uncle Harry Joe's gear, and give Joe a rebel and kit lens and the final images will be closer in appearance than you might first think.

THe OP started out by saying you need to watch your gear costs to shoot value weddings - it's true. You can shoot a wedding with a rebel and some third party lenses, maybe $2000 in gear. Or you can show up with $10,000 or even $30,000 in gear. If you've got 90 weddings (30/year, 3 year gear lifespan/depreciation) to pay for the gear, the $2000 route will make you more profitable, faster. However, I don't think you'll make the kinds of images that the pile of L gear will let you create. But the value customer isn't expecting it - they're not paying for it. And you don't have to feel guilty about giving them less - honda gives less than mercedes but they sleep at night just fine, I'm sure.

Some of it comes down to business or art? Are you in this to make money first, or art first?

Also, the OP mentions some outfit that does $799 weddings, but he also says they do 30 every weekend. There will be very different demands on the owner of such a company compared to the single shooter that does 30 weddings in a whole year. To do 30/week means 25 or 30 photogs - so quality will vary and IMO, not be consistent. You'll have turnover of employees. You'll need sales people, secretaries, editing people - you may not put any more money in your pocket at the end of the year with a lot more headaches, IMO.

He's probably right that the middle of the market is being squeezed. The rich can always afford what they want regardless of price or the economy. The middle will buy down when things get tight, or if the options are there - and right now they are - lots of newbies entering the photography market. I think it's a phase that will pass in a few years, but I'm not prescient and many of my predictions don't come true. This one may be more of a hope than a vision of tomorrow.

Bottom line is still economics - if there isn't a profit in it, then people won't do it. The barriers to this business are the lowest they've ever been, so more people are starting photography businesses. But the laws of supply and demand apply here too - too many photogs and the price falls, profitability isn't there, so they leave the biz and things return to more like normal. Or perhaps the market grows enough to feed us all, but that I doubt.

StanCox:
Aloha all!
However, as long as your Tamron or other lens is working properly, it will transfer the light to your film or sensor just as well as the more expensive lens.

What I'm saying here is basically, it's not so much the equipment but the user! I contend that in the hands of a creative and skilled photographer, a Rebel kit, or whatever, will produce the same results as the $7000 camera.

I believe it is perceived by the consumer that the photographer with the biggest lens and camera, is the better photographer...but it just aint so. You can give a $7000 camera to a soccor mom, and your still going to get "soccor mom" images!


Not so. A 1.2 or 1.4 lens will do things a 3.5 or 5.6 can't. A lens with USM will focus faster than one without. Better lenses have better coatings that give better, truer color and better contrast.
I've used lesser glass and better glass - and better glass matters. Perhaps not on a static subject at F10 in bright sun, but I rarely shoot under those conditions.
I'm paid to get the image, not give excuses. Image is everything. A blurry, underexposed image isn't going to make me much money. A third party flash that won't stand up to constant daily use, or has a battery door that won't stay shut, isn't worth a dime. A lens that's soft wide open is useless.
I can't call off on a rainy day, so I need weathersealed gear.

I started, like most, with third party gear and 'consumer' lenses. I have moved up to the good stuff, and continue to upgrade to better lenses and bodies. Yeah, it makes a difference. In the number of keepers for sure. In reduced PP time as well. It's not an ego thing, it's a confidence thing.

Yeah, I need an 'eye' and knowledge of posing, composing, and the like, but if I don't have the right tools to turn my mind's vision into an image then what's the point?

There have been many great images made on mediocre gear. But I don't know any top photographer that uses anything less than the best. Perhaps it's coincidence, but perhaps gear does make a difference afterall.

And this being a marketing thread/forum, if you use the best, latest gear then you have something to tell your clients that sets you apart from Uncle Harry or your competition down the street that shoots a rebel or 10D and tamron lenses.